[time-nuts] Neutrino timing

Attila Kinali attila at kinali.ch
Mon Oct 24 18:36:08 UTC 2011

On Mon, 24 Oct 2011 10:52:51 -0500
Marvin Marshak <marshak at umn.edu> wrote:

> A similar beam exists between Fermi National Accelerator Lab in Batavia IL and the University
> of Minnesota's Underground Laboratory at Soudan in northeastern Minnesota. This U.S. beam has
> been used to make a similar measurement, but the GPS timing equipment that was used
> (Truetime XL-AK, Model 600-101-015) resulted in an estimated uncertainty of about 70 ns 
> in the neutrino time-of-flight, too large to test the recently reported effect. I am one of a 
> group of physicists working with the neutrino beam in the U.S.
> Although we are also talking with professionals at USNO and NIST, I am interested in possible
> suggestions from the "Time Nut" community with respect to the following:

I and probably most others are not familiar with your measurement setup.
Could you at least provide a link to a paper that describes how your
time transfer/synchronisation setup looks like?

Also, what data have you recorded during your experiments?
What of this data is still available?

> 	(a) the possibility of retrospectively improving the existing timing data recorded since 2005 using
> the Truetime XL-AK, and

I currently only see one possibility to improve the timing data if you have
recorded the satelite phase data at both sites with each time stamp.

I know that with this, you can get a damn good precision in positioning
(a group at the ETH in Zürich uses this to get sub cm positioning with
standard LEA6-T modules, without any assisting technologies). I'm quite
sure this could be translated to timing presission as well.

> 	(b) a quick, low-cost improvement in the timing instrumentation that can be made right away, 
> pending arrangements for techniques such as Two-Way Satellite synchronization.

Without knowing your exact setup, it's hard to say. But first i'd try to
improve the oscilator stability in the XL-AK (ie use a rubidium). Maybe
it would also need a firmware change to really make use of this enhancement.

			Attila Kinali

It is upon moral qualities that a society is ultimately founded. All 
the prosperity and technological sophistication in the world is of no 
use without that foundation.
                 -- Miss Matheson, The Diamond Age, Neil Stephenson

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