[time-nuts] Advantages & Disadvantages of the TPLL Method
warrensjmail-one at yahoo.com
Mon Jun 21 03:23:30 UTC 2010
Well so much for my short 'berry' answers, that did not last long, sorry
You think you are tired of hearing the same ol repeated stuff over and over
and over ...,
Think about how tired I am of needing to repeat it.
The simple TPLL works good enough to measure any OCXO that I'm aware of.
(Oh yea, I said that already about a hundred times, and tested it more than
To me and some others that has now been "proven" well enough to make this
What else do you and most others need to know to use it?
Do you need to know exactly why mine works so good or how to make it better
or how good one could make it with 'new' parts??
When was the last time anyone needed to fully understand the inter workings
and details and limitations of their cell phone or TV or their TSC 5120A
before they were able to make use of it?
I don't need to understand it better, remember I'm the one with the working
I'm not looking to make mine better than I already know how to do.
What I have made more than clear by now, is that they should not rely on me
to tell them exactly how I did it,
If someone wants to understand it better, then they should build their own.
If they are not able to do that or at the VERY least come up with their own
schematic with the information given on John's report, then they certainly
are not going to be able to improve on it or analyze it.
What I have missed the point of and do not understand, is why any real
expert would ever need to know exactly how I did it, before they are able to
It is so simple that they can do it any number of different ways. Why do
they ONLY want to analyze mine?
They need to make their own schematic and analyze it. If they find it works
worse than I've said, sent me a copy and I'll tell them what they did wrong.
Likely theirs will work and analyze much better that what I've done and
said, because most will not make the KISS compromises that I have, and will
not want to use the same 6 or so parts I had in my parts bin.
>what you've demonstrated very clearly so far is
>that you just don't know whether or not that's true. (how good the results
That is close to right. It is others that do not know, I do agree to that
I know the limitations of what I've built and that it is not perfect and I
know how to make it even better.
But it is good enough and I do already know how good that is.
And the reason some say that I must now prove this to others is what I don't
I'm not trying to get anyone to believe I know what I'm doing,
I'm just trying to convince others that the TPLL method can work and is a
viable alternative sometimes.
Now it would seem that has already been done by all of John's test.
Some have suggested that I should just stop responding to these post, it is
going nowhere, and they are right,
but I have to admit, I'm having too much fun.
And if this can bring a little joy or education to others or make the TPLL
better understood then it is worth it,
even when it is at my expense.
wow OK, I must concede that JUST because this TPLL BB has ALWAYS worked in
the past for every condition and for hundreds of test,
this is not conclusive "prove" that it will not be completely wrong any or
every time in the future.
If this is the point that is now trying to be made with one of the later
Then at least ONE of us, is on the wrong SITE.
OH, and here is the real topper for all this.
Because I have made something that is so very basic and simple and obvious
and cheap and with so few parts and using a method that some so called
expert(s) did not seem to know about or understand because it is so old,
then I must be a fool or a genius.
SO Why is it OR? did you ever consider maybe it is both. :-)
It is pretty obvious with the hindsight that I've gained about some Nut
experts, that only a real fool would of ever started this project, let alone
try and tell ANYONE about it.
Have fun and do try and do what you enjoy or at least enjoy what you're
[time-nuts] Advantages & Disadvantages of the TPLL Method
GandalfG8 at aol.com GandalfG8 at aol.com
Sun Jun 20 22:05:14 UTC 2010
In a message dated 20/06/2010 22:11:51 GMT Daylight Time,
warrensjmail-one at yahoo.com writes:
I nice short response,
it shows missed the MAJOR difference. You need to see:
< http://www.thegleam.com/ke5fx/tpll.htm >
Your stock answer of claiming that everyone and his granny is missing the
point is wearing a bit thin, and despite your suggestion I have not missed
anything either and that includes John's results.
Those results, as far as they go, look very good, and I have no doubt you
deserve credit for what you've achieved, but what YOU seem to have missed,
or conveniently continue to ignore, is the need to be able to prove, or
provide sufficient information so that someone else can prove, that your
results are applicable to a more general case, and at least to the accuracy
There will always be empirical design methods, so called "rules of thumb"
for example, and these can be very valuable tools but the results from such
methods, indeed the results from any design method, still need to be
evaluated and confirmed in practice.
In a similar fashion your measurement technique, again as with all others,
needs validation and proper analysis of its limitations before you can
truly come to rely upon it as a stand alone tool.
It may well be "good enough" for everything you need but despite John's
measurements, and however good his results, what you haven't demonstrated
far is the ability to evaluate those limitations so you can be sure of
The only way at the moment that you can be really sure of your
measurements each and every time is to have someone like John check your
and every time.
It doesn't matter how many times your results are checked and confirmed,
and it doesn't matter that your technique might be perfect and your results
might be perfect every time, what you've demonstrated very clearly so far is
that you just don't know whether or not that's true.
I've wondered sometimes if you're just frightened that somebody might
prove you wrong but I don't recall anyone suggesting you're actually
all I've seen is folks trying to help you and offer well meant and useful
advice that could assist you properly evaluate the limitations of what
However, there must be a definite blockage somewhere because you seem to
have gone into auto repeat mode, and for someone who claims not to have time
to produce any documentation you must have wasted hours and hours churning
out the same old smokescreens.
Refusing to share your "recipe" so to speak, with all the bullshit you've
come up with as to why that shouldn't be necessary, and to insult and
attempt to belittle those who have tried to advise you, with all that crap
the "experts who just don't understand how it works" etc etc, well, sorry
mate but that really is the mark of a true snake oil salesman and, if
nothing else, you've certainly got that off to perfection.
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