[volt-nuts] HP3458a available (was Re: hp 3458a advice)

John Phillips john.phillips0 at gmail.com
Thu Feb 7 22:48:27 EST 2013


That is what I get for jumping in without reading the thread.
I have sent 2 or 3 units in for them to repair...
When they quit selling part I was forced to junk or have them repair.
What parts are needed?


On Thu, Feb 7, 2013 at 7:12 PM, Tom Miller <tmiller11147 at verizon.net> wrote:

> They might not take it in without a serial number.
>
> Regards
>
> ----- Original Message ----- From: "John Phillips" <
> john.phillips0 at gmail.com>
> To: "Discussion of precise voltage measurement" <volt-nuts at febo.com>
> Sent: Thursday, February 07, 2013 9:34 PM
>
> Subject: Re: [volt-nuts] HP3458a available (was Re: hp 3458a advice)
>
>
>  You should be able to any unit repaired by Agilent as long as all the
>> parts
>> are there for the $3000 flat rate repair and calibration charge.
>>
>> On Thu, Feb 7, 2013 at 5:59 PM, J. L. Trantham <jltran at att.net> wrote:
>>
>>  Paul,
>>>
>>> The 'value' of a 3458A is based on several issues, not the least of which
>>> is
>>> supply and demand.  You only have to look at theBay to get an idea of
>>> what
>>> units are selling for, both working and non-working.  The fact that the
>>> unit
>>> passes it's 'Self Test' is not a guarantee that it would be able to be
>>> calibrated to published performance specs.
>>>
>>> Tha Agilent website is very useful in determining an 'upper bound' on the
>>> value.  The 3458A is currently orderable and currently supported.  A new
>>> 3458A (without options) is available at $9,085 and would come with a
>>> fresh
>>> calibration and warranty.
>>>
>>> Repair Per Incident is available for $2,660.64.  This means that if you
>>> have
>>> a complete unit, they will repair it for that price.  That also comes
>>> with
>>> a
>>> fresh calibration.  I don't know if that price includes all recommended
>>> upgrades as listed in the Service Notes, of which there are 20, 6 of
>>> which
>>> list 'Modification Recommended' and one of which lists 'Modification
>>> Available'.  Perhaps someone on the forum knows the answer to this.
>>> Certainly Gary Biermann at Agilent can answer this.
>>>
>>> The fact that your unit does not have a serial number sticker but instead
>>> 'MTG PROTO 27' would be concerning as to whether Agilent would consider
>>> this
>>> a 'complete 3458A', and thus a candidate for repair, or, rather, a
>>> 'prototype' or some other descriptor that would imply that it looks like
>>> a
>>> 3458A but is really not a 3458A.
>>>
>>> Both new and newly calibrated units are candidates to add a Repair
>>> Agreement, available for $178.68 per year with up to 5 year blocks
>>> available
>>> for purchase.
>>>
>>> I note you mentioned firmware REV 2,1.  The current firmware is 9,1.
>>> Therefore it would appear that you have a rather old and probably not
>>> 'updated' unit.  That plus the 'stored in an attic' history would be
>>> concerning about the ability to repair the unit without changing several
>>> assemblies, etc.
>>>
>>> Assuming you could get the unit repaired and updated by Agilent, complete
>>> with a fresh calibration, then the maximum value would be $9,085 minus
>>> $2,660.64 minus what ever value you place on 'new' over 'old'.
>>>
>>> Then you are left with an older unit, made in the USA, with no (or
>>> perhaps
>>> a
>>> reduced) warranty as opposed to a new unit, made in Malaysia, with a
>>> warranty.  The question of whether a 'new' Malaysian unit or an 'old'
>>> American unit is better is the subject of further discussion and
>>> speculation.
>>>
>>> If the unit cannot be repaired by Agilent, then, in my opinion, the value
>>> goes down and approaches the value of the hardware, transformer, etc.,
>>> with
>>> serious questions about the state and reparability of the assemblies,
>>> particularly given the 'stored in an attic' history.
>>>
>>> Gary Biermann would be very helpful in getting the history and
>>> reparability
>>> of the unit.  He would be worth contacting about these issues.  He works
>>> at
>>> the Loveland Calibration Facility.
>>>
>>> Hope this helps.
>>>
>>> Joe
>>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: volt-nuts-bounces at febo.com [mailto:volt-nuts-bounces@**febo.com<volt-nuts-bounces at febo.com>]
>>> On
>>> Behalf Of Paul Fox
>>> Sent: Thursday, February 07, 2013 8:54 AM
>>> To: Discussion of precise voltage measurement
>>> Subject: Re: [volt-nuts] HP3458a available (was Re: hp 3458a advice)
>>>
>>> part of me hates to do this, but...   there have been some rule-breakers
>>> that ignored the "under $350" limit, and now they've ruined it for
>>> everyone. ;-)
>>>
>>> clearly the research i did into prices for "HP3458a, needs repair" was
>>> woefully inadequate.
>>>
>>> i guess the easiest thing to do is to simply remove the "under $350"
>>> part.  that way everyone's working under the same assumptions.  again,
>>> sorry.  local buyers still get preference.  (and, if you'd like to chew
>>> me out for being a bozo, that's fine, but please do it privately.  maybe
>>> i should have used ebay in the first place.  lesson learned.)
>>>
>>> paul
>>>
>>> i wrote:
>>>  > resurrecting a somewhat older thread --
>>>  >
>>>  > it's now clear to me that i have little interest in (or time for)
>>>  > resurrecting my 3458a.  several people on the list were interested in
>>>  > it when i first brought it up, and you were all very helpful.  i'd
>>>  > rather not go through the ebay hassle, and i'd rather make it
>>>  > available to one of you folks first in any case.
>>>  >
>>>  > i've put up a small set of pictures, along with a short video of
>>>  > the startup sequence at http://www.foxharp.net/hp3458a .  re-reading
>>>  > my original list message (below), i see that my startup video didn't
>>>  > capture an error message i saw back in october.  so in addition to the
>>>  > "110, Calibration required -- ACAL" message in the video, i guess we
>>>  > should assume that it sometimes gives "204, "Hardware Failure --
>>> Flatness
>>>  > DAC Convergence:  198"
>>>  >
>>>  > i haven't opened the unit, and wasn't really planning on it.  if
>>>  > there's something that you'd like to know that will be clear from just
>>>  > looking, and if it might appreciably change the unit's value for you,
>>>  > let me know and i'll find a screwdriver and take some more pictures.
>>>  >
>>>  > i have two original (i believe) copies of the manual.  no service
>>> manual.
>>>  > firmware version is "REV 2,1".
>>>  >
>>>  > so how about this:  best offer (by private mail) under $350 gets it,
>>>  > shipping not included (it looks like shipping will be in the $40 to
>>> $80
>>>  > range, once i find a box).  for obvious reasons, a local-to-boston
>>>  > transaction will be given a lot of preference.
>>>  >
>>>  > i'll wait until next wednesday evening (i.e., about a week -- feb 13)
>>>  > before choosing a lucky recipient, since i hear some people don't read
>>>  > their mail as continuously as i do.
>>>  >
>>>  > paul
>>>  >
>>>  > i wrote:
>>>  >  > thanks joe, and to the other couple of people who responded
>>> privately.
>>>
>>>  >  > i need to figure out how much of a project i want this to be, and
>>> how
>>>  >  > it ranks against all the other projects that i also don't have time
>>>  >  > for.  :-)
>>>  >  >
>>>  >  > i have the full users manual (two copies!), but i don't have
>>> anything
>>>  >  > else that speaks GPIB.  i'll play with some of the front panel
>>>  >  > commands you've suggested, while i think about what to do.  thanks!
>>>  >  >
>>>  >  > paul
>>>  >  >
>>>  >  > j. l. trantham wrote:
>>>  >  >  > Paul,
>>>  >  >  >
>>>  >  >  > First, the meter is worth something if nothing other than parts.
>>> It is
>>>  >  ...
>>>  >  >  > Good luck.
>>>  >  >  >
>>>  >  >  > Joe
>>>  >  >  >
>>>  >  >  > -----Original Message-----
>>>  >  >  > From: volt-nuts-bounces at febo.com
>>> [mailto:volt-nuts-bounces@**febo.com <volt-nuts-bounces at febo.com>] On
>>>  >  >  > Behalf Of Paul Fox
>>>  >  >  > Sent: Monday, October 15, 2012 9:50 AM
>>>  >  >  > To: Discussion of precise voltage measurement
>>>  >  >  > Subject: [volt-nuts] hp 3458a advice
>>>  >  >  >
>>>  >  >  > hi --
>>>  >  >  >
>>>  >  >  > i'm not a volt-nuts regular, and not even a precision
>>> measurement
>>> nut
>>>  >  >  > at all, but given past discussion in the list archives, i think
>>> you
>>>  >  >  > folks might be able to help.
>>>  >  >  >
>>>  >  >  > i was recently given an HP 3458a multimeter.  the donor thought
>>> it
>>>  >  >  > worked when he last used it, but that was quite a long time ago,
>>> and i
>>>  >  >  > think it was stored in an attic for some time, so i'm not too
>>>  >  >  > surprised that it now doesn't pass self tests. :-/  he mainly
>>> wanted
>>>  >  >  > it out of his house, along with a bunch of other vintage (sadly
>>> mostly
>>>  >  >  > non-working) equipment he'd accumulated over the years.
>>>  >  >  >
>>>  >  >  > the self-test error is:
>>>  >  >  >     ERRSTR 204, "Hardware Failure -- Flatness DAC Convergence:
>>> 198"
>>>  >  >  >
>>>  >  >  > judging from past list traffic, repairs on these units are
>>>  >  >  > expensive, and it would still need recalibration to be useful,
>>> and
>>>  >  >  > there are may be other parts (eeproms?) that may not be good
>>>  >  >  > any more.  i'm not really interested in pursuing any of this
>>>  >  >  > myself.
>>>  >  >  >
>>>  >  >  > what's worse is that the unit doesn't have a serial number.  (i
>>> assume
>>>  >  >  > the s/n would normally be obvious on the rear of the unit.)  it
>>> bears a
>>>  >  >  > sticker on the back that says "MTG PROTO 27".  i think the unit
>>> came
>>>  >  >  > from a place that themselves produced reference standards, and
>>> they
>>>  >  >  > may have gotten a very early model from HP to work with.  that's
>>>  >  >  > conjecture.  i haven't opened the unit, so i don't know if there
>>> are
>>>  >  >  > other clues to its age inside.
>>>  >  >  >
>>>  >  >  > so:  is this machine useful to anyone?  given the error message
>>> above,
>>>  >  >  > are there any measurements at all that it might still get
>>> correct,
>>> in
>>>  >  >  > it's current state?
>>>  >  >  >
>>>  >  >  > paul
>>>  >  >  > =---------------------
>>>  >  >  >  paul fox, pgf at foxharp.boston.ma.us (arlington, ma, where it's
>>> 63.1
>>> degrees)
>>>  >  >  >
>>>  >
>>>  > =---------------------
>>>  >  paul fox, pgf at foxharp.boston.ma.us (arlington, ma, where it's 30.0
>>> degrees)
>>>  > ______________________________**_________________
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>>>
>>> =---------------------
>>>  paul fox, pgf at foxharp.boston.ma.us (arlington, ma, where it's 19.2
>>> degrees)
>>> ______________________________**_________________
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>>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> John Phillips
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-- 
John Phillips


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